Dr. Nathan Parker Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 Has anyone successfully imported a User Tool from RTF or can you only use Plain Text, HTML, and PDF? That would be a major omission if we don't have it. I also see no option for import from Word Document. I may need to file some feature requests (and I'll move this thread to "Feature Requests" if I need to). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Simpson Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 (edited) see my reply to you on the other post in this forum. No, only html, text, pdf and TLG. Edited January 7 by Ken Simpson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven MacDonald Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 (edited) 43 minutes ago, Dr. Nathan Parker said: Has anyone successfully imported a User Tool from RTF or can you only use Plain Text, HTML, and PDF? That would be a major omission if we don't have it. I also see no option for import from Word Document. I may need to file some feature requests (and I'll move this thread to "Feature Requests" if I need to). Thanks for touching on this topic. User Tools has been a major source of pain for me. If I could simply save my Word document as a PDF and import the PDF I would be happy. I have tried this and the formatting gets messed up during the import. I have tried saving Word as HTML and it looks good in the browser. Until I import it into Accordance where it loses color information. I would even consider creating a User Tool natively if the Editor wasn't so hideous and painful to work with. So, in summary, if you can get the Import Tool and Editor updated, it would be wonderful 🙂. I know there is plenty of other work to do but this would greatly add to the value of Accordance. And, with all that said, I would be glad to assist in testing any updates. Edited January 7 by Steven MacDonald spelling and addition. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Nathan Parker Posted January 7 Author Share Posted January 7 Thanks! Moving this to Feature Requests so we can track it. To clarify, my Feature Request is to allow the ability to import a PDF from a RTF or Word file. @Ken Simpson I can't find your other post. Can you DM it to me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Nathan Parker Posted January 7 Author Share Posted January 7 @Ken Simpson Found it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven S Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 8 hours ago, Dr. Nathan Parker said: Has anyone successfully imported a User Tool from RTF Hi @Dr. Nathan Parker. I know this isn't the question you asked, but I just wanted to note that you can import User Notes from RTF using the File > User Files > Import Notes Folder... command. That is, Accordance at least has some capability to import RTF, so that it may not be as big of a hurdle to get such a feature into importing User Tools. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Nathan Parker Posted January 7 Author Share Posted January 7 Good to know. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven MacDonald Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 It would be great if importing from Word document could be added as an option as well as RTF. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Atnip Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 I tried hard at using the import tool, and at best it was mediocre. I have basically given up until it is improved. I wanted the ability to search my many pdf and docx files along with my Accordance modules. But I found that using software like FileLocater Pro can do the searching in my non-Accordance modules, even though I would prefer the capability to have everything in one place to search and link. I spent a few weeks last Fall digitizing my entire print library, which means I have about 1,000 books now in pdf that I can search. I doubt I will ever import them into Bible software, even if the capability would become available, because of the sheer amount of time that would take. Unless you could just do some kind of drop your files into a folder and the software would add them to the search capabilities. It would be really, really nice to be able to right click a word in a text and have Accordance search my entire digitized library ... but my faith in Accordance (or the competitors) doesn't reach that far. 🙂 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miketisdell Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 RTL is a big problem not only with User tools, but notes, stacks, etc... It would really be nice if Accordance would address RTL editing; It is nice to have the ability to have RTL formatting in User Tools but editing RTL in user tools is still very problematic. As far as PDF's are concerned, It would be nice if you could just display the original PDF and use the imported data in the background for searches. The formatting of PDF's that contain non-English characters remains incredibly problematic. Right now, I edit an imported PDF to include a link to the original PDF at the top so that I can refer to the original rather than the imported document because far too much information is lost when the documents are imported. Many times the results are simply unreadable. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Simpson Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 On 1/7/2024 at 2:07 PM, Dr. Nathan Parker said: Thanks! Moving this to Feature Requests so we can track it. To clarify, my Feature Request is to allow the ability to import a PDF from a RTF or Word file. @Ken Simpson I can't find your other post. Can you DM it to me? No - I think you mean import a USER TOOL from a PDF, RTF or Word file don't you Nathan? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Nathan Parker Posted January 8 Author Share Posted January 8 @Ken Simpson It is. Thanks for clarifying it! I was a little under the weather when I posted this, so I'm sure I mixed it up. :-) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven MacDonald Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 It appears that the Convert to Permanent Tool option is currently broken. After choosing this option on a User Tool, I get the message that the Tool is currently not available to Accordance. However it appears in my Library but cannot be opened. I started from square one and created a simple text file in the Create User Tool with just several line of plain text with the same result. Can you confirm the issue on your end and ask the programmers to take a look? Thanks in advance! Screenshots below. Note, I am running Accordance 14.08 on INTEL MacBook Pro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Nathan Parker Posted January 8 Author Share Posted January 8 Copy this post to "Bug Reports: Mac" and tag me in it. I'll check it when I'm at my Intel Mac tomorrow. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven MacDonald Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 Done! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Simpson Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 1 hour ago, Steven MacDonald said: It appears that the Convert to Permanent Tool option is currently broken. Hi @Steven MacDonald, I didn't even know this was possible? Can you point me to where this is? I can't find it on a bit of a look. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven MacDonald Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 (edited) @Ken Simpson please see rough example below. Once you create or import your own resource there is an option in the top right dropdown menu under Tool Options to "Convert to Permanent Tool" which will make it searchable. In my case I am trying to create a lexicon and make it permanent so it will come up in my search results. Hope this help! Edited January 8 by Steven MacDonald added a couple words for clarity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Simpson Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 25 minutes ago, Steven MacDonald said: @Ken Simpson please see rough example below. Once you create or import your own resource there is an option in the top right dropdown menu under Tool Options to "Convert to Permanent Tool" which will make it searchable. In my case I am trying to create a lexicon and make it permanent so it will come up in my search results. Hope this help! Thanks! I had never noticed that! I'll have a look and play with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Simpson Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 (edited) @Steven MacDonald Just out of interest, what's the cash value in converting it to a permanent tool? Edited January 9 by Ken Simpson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlm Posted January 13 Share Posted January 13 (edited) On 1/6/2024 at 9:18 PM, Steven MacDonald said: If I could simply save my Word document as a PDF and import the PDF I would be happy. I have tried this and the formatting gets messed up during the import. I have tried saving Word as HTML and it looks good in the browser. Until I import it into Accordance where it loses color information. A PDF is only meant for viewing and printing. In general, it has no document structure: even words are just letters that happen to be near one another on a page. In order to import a PDF, a program has to use heuristics to guess what the document structure was meant to be: these letters are close together, so they're probably part of the same word; these words are at the same vertical position, so they're probably part of the same line; there's some space between these lines and the next line of text, so that's probably a paragraph break; this text is in a larger font than other text, so it could be a heading; etc. So if you start with a Word document and save it as a PDF, you've thrown away information about the structure of the document that will have to be reconstructed by guessing. Microsoft and Adobe have invested a lot of time and effort into reconstructing structure for their PDF to MS Word conversion functionality: Oaktree has not and should not invest a comparable amount of effort, so lots of formatting and structure will go unrecognized. What Accordance needs is a robust importer for at least one format that preserves a notion of document structure (and formatting). One route would be to improve the HTML import, which is currently basic and poorly documented, but HTML has no notion of a footnote. RTF and .docx do have footnotes, and of the two, .docx is more likely to contain structure like headings. RTF can be just formatted text. There is a lot more variation in RTF than in .docx in terms of how they can be structured. Importing to a User Tool instead of directly to a regular Tool involves tradeoffs: User Tools are less rich in terms of structure and content (no footnotes, no tables, …), but can be edited to fix things that weren't done right during import or weren't in the file that was imported. Personally, I'd prefer to do my editing outside Accordance and import directly to a regular Tool, but that might not be what everyone wants. Edited January 13 by jlm 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Nathan Parker Posted January 13 Author Share Posted January 13 Great feedback. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven MacDonald Posted January 13 Share Posted January 13 Good points. I think .docx would be the best format to focus on. The user can format and color etc. in their Word processor and then do the import. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven MacDonald Posted February 10 Share Posted February 10 Just curious, any progress on importing from RTF, or Word? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Nathan Parker Posted February 10 Author Share Posted February 10 We don't have any ETAs on it at the moment since getting optimized for Sonoma 14.3 and getting syncing done are our priorities. I have it on the list to look at though. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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