Vaughn Hart Posted January 24, 2023 Share Posted January 24, 2023 Hi, Sefaria.org has the complete modules of Jewish thought on the old testament with their own translation which has a lot of interesting points. It's interesting to see what Jesus meant when he said certain things and we may have lost the centrality of certain edicts and more importantly the importance of the Holy Spirit. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Raynor Posted January 25, 2023 Share Posted January 25, 2023 I use their IOS app 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Nathan Parker Posted January 25, 2023 Share Posted January 25, 2023 Thanks for this! I’d love to see more Jewish tools in Accordance. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leopold Green Posted January 25, 2023 Share Posted January 25, 2023 15 hours ago, Gary Raynor said: I use their IOS app ditto I think it has been raised before about Accordance approaching them to see if some sort of deal could be worked out - Accordance would gain a huge amount of Jewish resources and Sefaria would gain a pathway where you could do advanced work on their collection which is simply not possible or feasible on their website or iOS app.. a win-win 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Nathan Parker Posted January 25, 2023 Share Posted January 25, 2023 Does someone have a list of what content on Sefaria is not currently available in Accordance? I’ll also download the iOS app myself and give it a try. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Nathan Parker Posted January 25, 2023 Share Posted January 25, 2023 Downloaded the iOS app and downloading the offline content now. Does anyone use a login with theirs or just the app without an account? Also, to access the content on desktop, do I just go to Sefaria.org? I may try it in the Accordance Web Browser. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leopold Green Posted January 25, 2023 Share Posted January 25, 2023 I signed up for an account and pay them a small sum because I believe in what they do - I don't think you need to give them anything for an account... I was hoping that perhaps you might have tentative talks to see if they are interested in working with Accordance - and honestly I don't know them and have nothing to gain other than they have the single best library of hebrew texts and it would be wonderful to see that library but searchable via accordance probably just a pipe dream 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaughn Hart Posted January 25, 2023 Author Share Posted January 25, 2023 (edited) I have an account with them and I use it when reading something in the Old Testament. I find it informative in that some of it has collective understanding... which predates Jesus and follows after Jesus (some of which I find take his influence and challenges and adapts it or adapts to it). There are some things that I have read in their commentary that Ive never heard in church and it makes some of what Jesus says very important. Not to say that they weren't important before... but Jesus repeats what God has been saying since Moses or since Job. Same thing over and over again. Also, Paul says... to them belong the Law and the Prophets... but God... through Jesus Christ... has made us a kingdom of priests which ties into Exodus. Jesus is the same yesterday, today and forever. I also think Jesus was well versed in synagogue life. And not having it seems like a boosting against root of the tree. Edited January 25, 2023 by Vaughn Hart 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaughn Hart Posted January 26, 2023 Author Share Posted January 26, 2023 And you need the "translation" as well... please note that the translation is from a source (people) who have been reading that same text from before we ever considered it a text, across every nation and language they have migrated to since the Assyrian/Babylonian captivity. Their translation in English does not confirm to any ideology or a particular theology influencing translation and it is critical to the commentary that also dates back to the Babylonian/Assyrian captivity where the synagogue was founded. Here are two examples of influence: 1) They don't write God's name in English as they believing using His Name breeds familiarity. But they don't translate it into Ha Shem. They leave it as the Tetragrammaton. 2) All our English bibles (NIV 2020, NASB 1995, Bible in Basic English, ESV, Young's Literal Translation, and the KJV all do the same thing with Genesis 4: The leave the conversation between God and Cain in prose form. . The Jewish text recognizes that it is poetry and they translate in English into poetry. None of our English bibles have that. None. And I've heard pastors preach from all of them and none of them have shown that as poetry and each of these translations say they're the best and most accurate and refute each other for their translation errors that they supposedly lead to theological erorrs but they all miss this point on Genesis 4. All of them. I didn't include the RSV photo. https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis 4&version=RSV We need this translation as well. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ukfraser Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 (edited) Vaughn, thanks. I am Just adding screen shots from tree of life and jewish publishing society versions as well as the translation that is included in the Torah, a modern commentary to add to the above for comparison as i found the way they deal with the points you raised to be interesting especially as chapter three is often set out as poetry in many translations. The nrsv falls in line with the examples you have included. (Like others, i have the app on my ipad.) Edited January 26, 2023 by ukfraser 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaughn Hart Posted January 26, 2023 Author Share Posted January 26, 2023 Hey UK Fraser... Thanks for that... I have not seen this version before... but I like the Sefaria version because I think it might be widely used in the Orthodox/Conservative Jewish community... globally, so there are a lot of eyes on it. And they're using text that 's being refereed to in the commentaries, so it has to line up... and some of these commentaries are over a 1000 years old. I'd recommend reaching the passages on Genesis 4 and Exodus 4 with the commentaries on Sefaria.org. I'd like to know what you think. What do you make of the conversation between God and Cain'? And God and Moses? And the similarity of their brothers? What do you think about God's prophetic declaration - by this I mean... their tie into Isa 42:8-9. I am particularly interested in the anger... and the speech. Let me know what you think? I'm still reading. For comparison take a look at Genesis 17-18. And then take a look at Jesus. -Vaughn 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ukfraser Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 (edited) Totally agree about sefaria but just wanted to share what is already in accordance. I thought i had better include some of the forum guidelines in case anyone is tempted to step over them (and before we get a warning). Quote: We encourage you to discuss Accordance features, to share tips and tricks for getting the most out of Accordance, ... and to discuss any aspect of Accordance use which may be of interest to other users. Discussion of biblical interpretation, points of theology, and personal beliefs is inappropriate for this board, ... While we encourage such interchange, we ask that you discuss these issues privately, rather than using the public sections of the Forums. Content directly attacking the character of a person or group, publicly or privately, is also prohibited. https://forums.accordancebible.com/guidelines/ Edited January 26, 2023 by ukfraser 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Nathan Parker Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 Thanks! I’ll chat with marketing about this. In the meantime, I’ll register for an account. I may even send them a small occasional donation. It’s great to hear there’s interest in this! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaughn Hart Posted January 26, 2023 Author Share Posted January 26, 2023 (edited) Thanks for the reminder about the guidelines.... I rarely use the forums... so I didn't take a look at the rules. I also never looked at Sefaria.org before this year... but I think they are struggling as it seems that all faith based textual works are suffering and they are doing... good work. I think I was at a place reading ancient Egyptian texts and someone commented that they were religious and shouldn't be read on my shift. Except that the text are actually guidance from a commander to his son. I can't donate right now... I'm without a job... and looking for one. But I thought I'd share it with you all... I'm finding their (ancient Jewish commentary) really insightful and O so different from what we have now. The analysis is part cross-reference, part etymological, historical and contextual (for a people, place and time). Like every moment with God. We have so much new research that seems to ignore the stuff that was already there. Like a mirror that only sees two feet back. I wish I could find the anthropologist whose work is cited by someone famous (present day) but basically because it's all regurgitated stuff (with modern taste) since the old guy is unpopular. And this is in science. Edited January 26, 2023 by Vaughn Hart 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ukfraser Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 (edited) Not sure if you have come across this set but there is a very revealing interview from michael carasik on the background to the various commentators which is worth searching for on the web. (I wish he would write a book about them.) https://www.accordancebible.com/product/commentators-bible-the-set-of-5-volumes/ Edited January 26, 2023 by ukfraser 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Nathan Parker Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 Thanks for pointing out this site, and if there are any other Jewish resources sites you want to recommend we look into, feel free to suggest them. I’d like to work on getting more Jewish modules into Accordance. As one of Jewish ancestry myself, it’s an area I’d love to personally work on expanding our offerings. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaughn Hart Posted January 26, 2023 Author Share Posted January 26, 2023 (edited) No confirmed Jewish ancestry (though there is Levy in the last name on the family tree) but I was at RIT (eons ago) and I wondered what happened in the church.... where'd the Jewish Jesus go. To me Jesus saying during Hanukkah - Before Abraham was, I am, didn't seem controversial. I did go to a few Messianic congregations then a church that was a mix of Jew and Gentile but only recently going back to more homogenous churches (that aren't black, as I am) made me wonder again. In reading Ecc 5 1-7 iat the start of a service and I was struck. I found the reference to the Egyptian text and then I went hunting for the Jewish commentaries and found Sefaria.org.. Edited January 26, 2023 by Vaughn Hart 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Nathan Parker Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 FFOZ also has Jewish commentaries from a Messianic perspective and are pretty popular. I never did invest in them though. I need to spend more time on Sefaria. I do watch some videos on Torah Anytime which I’ve enjoyed. I’ve found Aish to be useful as well (plus I like their Western Wall Cam). I ordered a Menorah from Israel the other year, and this year, Israel ended up sending me two more of them through my Lev Haolam membership. Gave one to my brother. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Accordance Enthusiast Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 I would also like to see more modules from Sefaria, especially two of their lexicons which are not available in Accordance. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaughn Hart Posted January 27, 2023 Author Share Posted January 27, 2023 My channukiah's in storage as well as my shofars. I think the one commentary that really blessed me was the Akeidat Yitzchak... I'm not sure if Accordance has that... but it opened something up in my understanding. Any I donated. You know... the cost of sandwich or Chinese food in NYC can be more expensive. Ak eidat Yitzchak 62:1:5 Ak eidat Yitzchak 62:1:5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian K. Mitchell Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 15 hours ago, Nathan Parker said: Thanks for pointing out this site, and if there are any other Jewish resources sites you want to recommend we look into, feel free to suggest them. I’d like to work on getting more Jewish modules into Accordance. As one of Jewish ancestry myself, it’s an area I’d love to personally work on expanding our offerings. Hey have you checked out Wikisource's Hebrew collection? They have the (Mikraot Gedolot) מקראות גדולות with all it's commentaries in Hebrew: https://he.wikisource.org/wiki/מקראות_גדולות . These are released under a Creative Commons license 3.0. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Nathan Parker Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 6 hours ago, Brian K. Mitchell said: Hey have you checked out Wikisource's Hebrew collection? They have the (Mikraot Gedolot) מקראות גדולות with all it's commentaries in Hebrew: https://he.wikisource.org/wiki/מקראות_גדולות . These are released under a Creative Commons license 3.0. I haven’t yet, but will check it out. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Nathan Parker Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 I found out all of Sefaria’s content is available as open source/public domain and can be downloaded from GitHub. It’s all freely available to use. Technically, if some Accordance users really wanted the content in Accordance fast, they could make User Tools of any of the content on there. That might be the quickest way to get some of the content into Accordance so you wouldn’t have to wait on the process that commercial modules take. If we were to still look into developing commercial modules through a Sefaria partnership, I’d have to research with our marketing team to see how that would work since they typically give their stuff away as donationware being a nonprofit. Maybe they’d let us develop the modules, most of the funding would go to support them as a donation, with Accordance getting what it needs to cover module development costs/expenses. Not sure how all that would work on something like this yet. In the meantime, since it is all public domain/freely available, anyone who wants to try User Tools of these, feel free to. That’d be one quick way of turning this dream into reality. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlm Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 4 hours ago, Nathan Parker said: In the meantime, since it is all public domain/freely available, anyone who wants to try User Tools of these, feel free to. That’d be one quick way of turning this dream into reality. In theory, yes, but there are still bugs with User Tool import that keep me from making a commentary. I’m waiting patiently, but at this point there is not a quick way of turning such dreams into reality. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaughn Hart Posted January 28, 2023 Author Share Posted January 28, 2023 @jlmthank you.... I almost watched the User Tools video... and then I realized something that was said at the beginning... and stopped watching. @Nathan Parkerthank you as well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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