A. Smith Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 1 minute ago, Paul Meiklejohn said: No, the admin team can reset your account. See I just saw this and send you a message. Sorry, I haven't been on the new forum more than a few minutes. Lot's going on at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A. Smith Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 3 minutes ago, R. Mansfield said: It becomes an issue of supporting multiple syncing options--which is not only a support issue but also extra development and added code to the software. And it creates a better experience for some users over others. Not really a good place to be. A better solution would be to have one really good syncing method that works for every platform and syncs more than what is currently synced. Stay tuned. Well, macOS users, by virtue of using macOS, already have a better user experience . . . so . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Weaks Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 Since iCloud has such great developer kits, and an entire support system ready to go, it's a shame that it's not an option for Accordance on macOS and iPadOS and iOS. My apps that use iCloud sync are so good. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Mansfield Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 5 minutes ago, Joe Weaks said: Since iCloud has such great developer kits, and an entire support system ready to go, it's a shame that it's not an option for Accordance on macOS and iPadOS and iOS. My apps that use iCloud sync are so good. Joe, that's easy to say if all you use is macOS and iOS. Imagine, though, if you were a Windows and/or Android user, and we came out with this super, seamless syncing strategy that completely excluded you. And we said, hey, just keep using Dropbox, while we look for something else. I mean, that's really not a good strategy for maintaining customer goodwill. A better plan would be to create a super, seamless syncing strategy that works for everyone. Also, I should point out that a large number of Windows users who also use iPhones. There's an incredible amount of cross-platform syncing to take into account. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lester P. Bagley Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 6 minutes ago, R. Mansfield said: Joe, that's easy to say if all you use is macOS and iOS. Imagine, though, if you were a Windows and/or Android user, and we came out with this super, seamless syncing strategy that completely excluded you. And we said, hey, just keep using Dropbox, while we look for something else. I mean, that's really not a good strategy for maintaining customer goodwill. A better plan would be to create a super, seamless syncing strategy that works for everyone. Also, I should point out that a large number of Windows users who also use iPhones. There's an incredible amount of cross-platform syncing to take into account. To be fair, for those of us who bought Accordance years ago for the Mac platform it's a bit like saying no longer matter. Current syncing strategy is to excluded us or at least keep us using something highly inferior. Expansion to so many platforms may be good for business but it comes at a cost to your oldest loyal users. Please remember to take us into account too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Mansfield Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 6 minutes ago, Lester P. Bagley said: To be fair, for those of us who bought Accordance years ago for the Mac platform it's a bit like saying no longer matter. Current syncing strategy is to excluded us or at least keep us using something highly inferior. Expansion to so many platforms may be good for business but it comes at a cost to your oldest loyal users. Please remember to take us into account too. Of course. We're not saying that some users, especially those who have been with us the longest, don't matter. What I'm suggesting is that we are trying to give equal worth to all users, whether you've been with us a long time or a short time. The reality is that if we had stayed Mac-only, we probably wouldn't be here. The Windows emulator was not a good solution, and we found a better one by creating a Windows-native app. A very significant competitor is no longer around because they stayed Windows-only and opted not to create a mobile app, which is probably where the greatest potential for growth lies. We are still here and doing well because we "cast our bread on the surface of" many platforms. Although I can't give specifics, I am personally confident that the syncing issues will only get better. Know that we hear you, and we believe this is an important issue. 7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Allen Posted February 25, 2021 Author Share Posted February 25, 2021 I regret posting this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Weaks Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 7 hours ago, R. Mansfield said: Joe, that's easy to say if all you use is macOS and iOS… Of course, yes, iCloud sync can only be one option. I was simply expressing a lament that this has not been implemented. Laments are healthy (and biblical). Of course there need be at least one other sync option. If iCloud sync were an option, in addition to any other sync option y'all implement, I'd choose iCloud. So, I lament it's not an option. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leopold Green Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 I use Ulysses for all my writing and it is highly integrated with iCloud and the result is a stunning experience going between Mac and iOS - I also have Scrivener which relies on Dropbox and I stopped using it because the sync process is so poor (and relies on Dropbox) that said Accordance isn't a writing programme and the sync requirement is much lower - I do think Joe makes a good point about iCloud being one of several options... We all need Accordance to remain a viable company so I accepted they have to do what they believe is right for the market place - I am sure that android/iOS will become ever greater parts of the portfolio so I hope that there is really progress to be made with the iPad version of accordance which is needs to break out of the two pane approach and desperately needs stacks, research, atlas and timeline to be a more effective content portal just my 5 pence worth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 A good sync solution doesn't need to use iCloud per se — I mean, I would love iCloud as an option if I had to choose amongst various 3rd party cloud solutions. If Accordance implements their own solution using their own services, it can be just as good as an iCloud solution and maintain cross platform capability (think Evernote, Omni products, etc). I think the frustration is the reliance on various 3rd party consumer cloud services that each have their own issues. I'm gathering from Rick (my observation / deduction — he hasn't stated as such), that a new solution would not rely on Dropbox or other consumer cloud service but would be self-hosted. This is my hope — and I'm definitely looking forward to it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottDF Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 Many apps and services I use allow the user to choose from any of a number of cloud, or self-hosted services. OakTree would need to keep current with APIs for as many of these services as they choose to support, but only a half dozen or so have been mentioned in this thread so that doesn't seem too onerous and would satisfy at least everyone who is posting here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Allen Posted February 25, 2021 Author Share Posted February 25, 2021 OK, look, I said I regret posting this, but here's why. Dropbox syncing IS a mess, to pretend otherwise is to deny reality. It needs to be fixed. But Accordance is a multi-platform app with a small development team and a niche user base. iCloud isn't a path forward, nor is opening up multiple cloud-sync solutions. The first because it only works with one segment of the user base. The second because adding bloat in from multiple cloud sync solutions, each of which has a different API and restrictions, would create even more problems. Yes, "But [insert app which uses multiple solutions] does this." And each of these apps has preferred options, and tend to be meant for use in a single platform to sync information from a single database. Accordance is rather more complex than that. The BEST option, which other Bible apps have shown to be workable, is to create an in house syncing solution which caters to Accordance's unique needs. One API, one code base, one solution, everyone gets it. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottDF Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 5 minutes ago, Wes Allen said: The BEST option, which other Bible apps have shown to be workable, is to create an in house syncing solution which caters to Accordance's unique needs. One API, one code base, one solution, everyone gets it. That is easily best from the User perspective, but having done this for a software company, it was more work ultimately for us to maintain the backend. OakTree's experience may be different, but we found it easier to maintain the various APIs. But again, from the User perspective, you are definitely right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Weaks Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 (edited) 6 hours ago, ScottDF said: … it was more work ultimately for us to maintain the backend… From the developers I know, I think this is unquestionably the case. It takes far more work and money to develop and maintain your own syncing service, than to implement and support the API's from 2 or 3 good ones. But, I'm cool with whatever. Edited February 25, 2021 by Joe Weaks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Mansfield Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 Just now, Joe Weaks said: From the developers I know, I think this is unquestionably the case. It takes far more work and money to develop and maintain your own syncing service, than to implement and support the API's from 2 or 3 good ones. On the other hand, you're dependent upon third parties which can sometimes work against you. Dropbox used to have a much more flexible free account, and then they changed that to the detriment of our users. It's always risky to put your fate in the hands of outside parties. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 As a developer in both the server and in the mobile space for more years than I like to admit, it's not like you write your own backend anymore. You leverage AWS or one of the other BaaS/XaaS providers to implement your custom cloud solution. It's not like the old days where you built out your server farm and wrote all your own backend code (which agreeably is not fun). While it's still more work than coding against iCloud and Dropbox, supporting/managing/testing multiple platforms is a lot of work and headache as well — and as already noted, a proprietary cloud solution is usually the best end-user experience. Anyway, I don't work for OakTree, and it's clear they have a bead on their own solution — whatever it may be — so I'll continue to look forward to it patiently!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottDF Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 17 minutes ago, R. Mansfield said: On the other hand, you're dependent upon third parties which can sometimes work against you. Dropbox used to have a much more flexible free account, and then they changed that to the detriment of our users. It's always risky to put your fate in the hands of outside parties. If OakTree people are tilting in the direction of taking control of the syncing in house, I'm definitely keeping my mouth closed from here on in. My fingers, however, will add another thanks to Rick's post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Jonathan Posted February 26, 2021 Share Posted February 26, 2021 If you can set up your own server, what about OwnCloud? It works across all platforms and all you need is the server. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josephorourke Posted March 9, 2021 Share Posted March 9, 2021 So I welcome a different sync platform. I have tried to use dropbox sync twice now and it has crashed both times. The first time deleting a pile of notes and study material. I actually back up my notes separately for that specific reason. For me, dropbox is a nightmare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fabian Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 Unfortunately iCloud is also not end-to-end encrypted. This is for me a must to use such a feature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 (edited) 4 hours ago, Fabian said: Unfortunately iCloud is also not end-to-end encrypted. This is for me a must to use such a feature. iCloud is end-to-end encrypted (and always has been). https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT202303 Edited March 10, 2021 by Rich 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fabian Posted March 11, 2021 Share Posted March 11, 2021 23 hours ago, Rich said: iCloud is end-to-end encrypted (and always has been). https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT202303 O.K. Thanks it seems Apple has done in April 2020 something for more secure. You need 2FA. Some say it is still not very secure. https://teamdrive.com/apple-scannt-icloud-daten/ Some give a second encryption https://www.boxcryptor.com/de/icloud/ But in all iCloud Backups are not encrypted. https://www.heise.de/mac-and-i/meldung/Apple-Volle-Verschluesselung-fuer-iCloud-Backups-angeblich-nach-FBI-Gespraech-verworfen-4642839.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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