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How to find future tense Greek verbs rendered as present tense in KJV


EricC
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Hi, everybody.

 

I'm wondering if there is a way in Accordance 13.1.1 to find all future tense Greek verbs rendered as present tense in KJV? But I guess there would have to be morphology tagging applied to the KJV's English words, right, and we don't have that in Accordance, do we?

 

Actually, I'd be interested in finding this phenomenon in other translations, too, but not as interested as I am in in finding them in the KJV.

 

Here's why this came up. In studying Galatians 6:16, I see that for the future active indicative third person plural form στοιχήσουσιν, the KJV has the present "as many as walk according to this rule", while the NASB has the future "those that will walk by this rule."

 

Here's info on that verb from the SIL Exegitical Summary Series:

 

pres. act. indic. of στοιχέω (LN 41.12) (BAGD p. 769): ‘to live’ [LN, SSA; NLT], ‘to walk’ [Mor; KJV, NASB], ‘to behave in accordance with’ [LN; NET], ‘to conduct (oneself) in accordance with’ [LN], ‘to follow’ [bAGD, BNTC, Herm, WBC; CEV, NCV, NIV, NRSV, TEV], ‘to conform to’ [GW].  Robert Stutzman, An Exegetical Summary of Galatians, Exegetical Summary Series. Accordance electronic ed. (Dallas: SIL International, 2006), 261.)

 

What I tentatively found as far as English language translations go has informed me that many translators or translation committees had no problem rendering the Greek future tense as present in English. In fact, in my unscientific sample, more translated with the present tense than with the future tense.

 

Future rendered as present in target language:
KJV, NKJV, ESV, HCSB, CSB, NIV1985, NIV2011, TNIV, NLT-SE
Future rendered as future in target language:
NASB1977, NASB1995, Mounce NT, NET, MLV

 

I don't have Douglas Moo's Galatians Commentary (or any of the Baker Exegetical Commentary series) on my computer, but Google Books found this note from that commentary:

post-3736-0-44894600-1593607183_thumb.png

 

Of course, that raises the question as to whether those who rendered it as present did so because they were relying on a text with the present form, or whether they did it because they thought the Greek future was well rendered as a present in this case. We'll probably never know what their reasons were.

 

Anyway, my question remains: can I find all instances where a future in the underlying (or a selected) Greek text (in this case the TR) is rendered as a present in English?

 

Thank you! -Eric

 

An aside: Oh, how I wish Accordance would finally offer the Scrivener's TR text!

 

Edit: add bold
Edit: "which" to "wish", etc.
 

Edited by EricC
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An aside: Oh, how I which Accordance would finally offer the Scrivener's TR text!)

 

+1 

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Eric, this is an interesting question.  As you note, we don't currently have a morphological parsing of the KJV, so Accordance doesn't actually know which words are present tense in English or not.  However, you can get sort of closer.  First, do a TEXT search in your KJVS text for:

 

[GNT-TR [VERB future]]

 

This will find all of the KJVS words for future tense verbs.  Now you can either work through the list yourself, or open up the analysis and look for english verbs with a present tense.  I hope this helps!

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Joel, is there are a way to do the TEXT search but exclude any hits that are within, say, 5 words of (shall, will) in the KJVS? I couldn't figure out a syntax for that. 

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Won't all English futures have the auxiliary "will" in close proximity ? I haven't tried to use this but is there a way to use that here - excluding all translations where "will" is not present.

 

EDIT: Ah I see Jonathan beat me to it. :)

 

Thx

D

Edited by דָנִיאֶל
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OK, ya'll, I'm in over my head. I don't think I've ever done a Construct Search in Accordance. I watched the Lighting the Lamp podcast #142, and learned a few things, but I still can't figure out how to do what Joel Brown did above.

 

Questions:

(1) Is this a Simple Construct or Greek Construct? I assume it's Simple, since I don't see "Word" in the list of options for Greek Constructs.

 

I succeeded in getting "WORD" with "shall, will" in the two colums like Joel's.

post-3736-0-80227200-1593678293_thumb.png

 

(2) But I can't figure out how to get the "GNT-TR" [VERB future]" stuff in the intervening column. How do I do that?

 

(3) I'm not too sure how the linking works, either. In the GNT-TR tab in the other zone (?) I put in [VERB future], and I can see that all the future verbs are highlighted. But then I lose the link to the Construct. When I go back and link the Construct to GNT-TR, I lose the [VERB future] stuff in the search box there, and then comes up what you see in the screenshot.

 

Could someone either explain this to me or do a short video of how to do it and provide a link? Thank you!

Edited by EricC
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Not answering your specific questions so Slightly off topic but In addition to lighting the lamp, there has been a lot more recent information.

 

The eacadamy sessions are listed on the support pages but There have been several recent webinars on searching which are also worth checking out here As i couldnt see them listed under support and these are a gold mine! especially if you havent attended any or viewed them before. (I cant remember the exact detail As ive been to several which covered a lot and i seem to remember construct searches being dealt with in the last couple of months so scroll down to the greek and hebrew section :

 

https://www.gotostage.com/channel/2b99bda9c3ed4b7382a55737a7d54b46

Edited by ukfraser
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Eric, you'll be searching in the KJV, using the "Simple" construct, since the KJV is an English Text.

You'll use the "Text" command to enter the GNT-TR content. It sounds like you have everything else figured out.

 

(BTW, the Text command is a feature of version 13. Your profile says you're on version 12, but perhaps you just haven't updated it—mine says I'm on version 5 after all :-)
 

Edited by Mark Allison
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Eric, you'll be searching in the KJV, using the "Simple" construct, since the KJV is an English Text.

You'll use the "Text" command to enter the GNT-TR content. It sounds like you have everything else figured out.

 

(BTW, the Text command is a feature of version 13. Your profile says you're on version 12, but perhaps you just haven't updated it—mine says I'm on version 5 after all :-)

 

Thanks, Mark. Your advice worked. Way to go! I hadn't thought of "TEXT" going in that middle column (obviously). Here's what my construct looks like now:

 

post-3736-0-97108800-1593709800_thumb.png

 

New question: After adding "shalt" to the words to be excluded and increasing the "within" criterion to 1-6, I have 111 hits in 102 verses. I know this is elementary, but how can I get a list of those verses and/or a list of the references to those verses, and/or a list of the Greek future verbs with the references (if this is possible; i.e., not the whole verse).

 

And thanks for the heads up on the profile. I'm glad you're able to get so much done on version 5. :) I changed my profile to show I'm on 13.x. But even with v. 13.1.2, I still can't do as well as you do on v. 5! :D

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And thanks for the heads up on the profile. I'm glad you're able to get so much done on version 5. :) I changed my profile to show I'm on 13.x. But even with v. 13.1.2, I still can't do as well as you do on v. 5! :D

 

Lol!

 

So, if you want a list of references, just do a "select all" on the verses in the KJV tab, then right-click and select "Copy As—>References"

If you want a list of the Greek Verbs, click on the Analytics button (looks like a pie chart, next to the "111" hits) and select "Analysis". 

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Didn't OP want to find present verbs in English where Greek text verb is future? Shouldn't the construct then have NOT applied against the outer "Word" elements? When I execute the attached (I'm using NASB) I find present tense English verbs and Instant Details shows that in the Greek they are future. 

post-35562-0-99016100-1594164570_thumb.png

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